Author Topic: Tips On Character Building  (Read 2119 times)

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Offline DwayneA

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Tips On Character Building
« on: 05 March 2020, 00:36:54 »
As I said in my first thread, I only took one character through Immortal Throne in the past and not playing anymore because I didn't think I was any good at the game. The character was a Conqueror, which I thought was a good choice for a beginner because this class has the highest base health of all characters when both masteries are maxed. I struggled through the game and felt like I wasn't doing much damage. I had to frequently visit the mystics in order to reallocate skill points, whether to spend on other skills or the mastery itself. Even when I reached Hades, my character wasn't dealing impressive damage and I didn't have high-level skills like I usually do when playing Diablo II.

So before I try this character again through Atlantis and Anniversary Edition, (or any other character for that matter), I'd appreciate it if someone could answers these questions to help me build a good character and spend my skill and stat points wisely.

-Which masteries are best to start the game with?
-Should I wait to pick my second mastery even at level 8?
-How many points per level should be spent on the mastery and how many per level on skills?
-How do I know if I should get a skill right away or if I should wait?
-What determines if a skill should get more than one point or be maxed?
-Should I max some skills as soon as they are available?
-Should I spend my stat points as soon as I get them or should I reserve them?

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Offline MedeaFleecestealer

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Re: Tips On Character Building
« Reply #1 on: 05 March 2020, 07:21:18 »
This is pretty much personal taste and also depends on what type of character you're planning to play.  Assuming by "this character" you mean another Conqueror then this is what I used for my 2.

https://www.tqcalc.com/TitanCalc738c738c738c.html?mastery=Conquerer&master1=5&master2=3&sa=30&m1=32-8-1-0-6-12-0-0-6-6-6-12-0-0-6-8-6-6-0-0-6-0-0-0-0&m2=32-6-1-8-0-8-6-0-0-0-0-0-0-6-0-0-0-0-0-6-0-0-0-0-0

Like you I was new to the game the first time I played one so chose the tankiest option I could think of.  Second time was because of a failed PC and no backup made (learnt lesson about that).

For me Defense is the first mastery simply because of it's defensive qualities; it'll get you through those first early levels without too much difficulty.  Once I chose Warfare at L8 it was max out Onslaught; this is one of the few skills in the game where it pays to max it out early.

Apart from maxing out Onslaught I usually climb the mastery bars putting a point in the skills I plan to take and then start maxing those skills out.  I probably climbed Defense first and then started maxing out a skill in there with a point each level while using the other two to climb Warfare and put points into those skills. 

What determines whether a skill is maxed or not is a question of how useful it is and what your playstyle is.  You can see from the tqcalc that I like a quite simple style.  A skill on the LMB, another on the RMB and pretty much passives after that.  Other people prefer to use many skills.  You'll see that I've only put a point into Battle Rage, this is because apart from increasing physical damage a bit nothing else in the skill changes so to me it's not worth more than the one point.  Neither it's chance to activate nor it's % OA increases with more points. 

As for stat points again this is a matter of personal preference.  Lots of people do prefer to keep some in reserve, but since I plan my builds out with the calc I never hang on to any since I know exactly where I'm going to be putting them.

For the above build you could look at adding Battle Standard and Rally, although I personally don't like them because of their long cooldowns and also you could consider War Wind/Lacerate as an alternative to Shield Charge or in addition. Colossus Form can be fun even with just one point in it, but you have to be careful not to use it in a space you can't get out of until you shrink back down again.

This is the guide I used way back in 2008 when I first started playing the game.  Although written for the original TQ only I think a lot of the advice in there still holds good today.

https://titanquestfans.net/index.php?topic=612.0

Also bear in mind that you and me didn't have really good gear when we played these.  We had to make do with what we found/bought along the way and that gives a different playstyle to a Conqueror who has BiS gear from many years of item collecting.

I didn't play D2 much and never at high levels, but if you're expecting flashy skills that fill the screen then you're going to be disappointed.  TQ doesn't have them.  For that you'd be better playing TQ's spiritual successor Grim Dawn.

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Offline DwayneA

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Re: Tips On Character Building
« Reply #2 on: 05 March 2020, 15:42:45 »
um, why didn't you completely max both masteries on the calculator link? Wouldn't maxing them give you more stat and health bonuses? Why did you leave them at level 32?

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Offline MedeaFleecestealer

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Re: Tips On Character Building
« Reply #3 on: 05 March 2020, 16:03:23 »
32 was the max level you could reach in the original game. Yes you could push up to 40 on one or two if you want. The build is only L55 and the max level for the game with Ragnarok is 85 now.  Not sure if Atlantis pushed it even higher.  Also none of the skills at that level appeal to me; remember that in the game you can't take points out of the mastery bars, only out of skills.  So if you push up to 40 and then decide it wasn't worth it you can't get those points back to use elsewhere. 

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Offline Tasim

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Re: Tips On Character Building
« Reply #4 on: 14 March 2020, 08:44:44 »
Conqueror is a really slow-start type of build. My first character where I really knew what was I doing was a Conqueror and I didn't start "having fun" with it untill mid-epic. In addition to this, as Medea stated, gear is a big "problem" for any first character, simply because it's your first character and you don't have a vault full of gear to choose from. Farming goes a long way in this game and recently I saw a really good quote from someone along these lines: playing with your first character isn't just playing for your character, it's playing for your gear vault.

To put this into perspective, my second character was a Templar, and by the time I got it up to, let's say lvl 40, it was a mean killing machine without any deaths because I had so many gear stashed up that I could do whatever I wanted with it. On my Conqueror it was always "okay, I need a new shield, time to farm for it". My Conqueror is currently lvl 72 with in-game time of 5 days and 15 hours and I'm still in Greece on Legendary difficulty, poking the Hydra in the face for a new shield drop.

As far as playstyle and how to build it, it really is up to you. Do you want a dualwield build, shield build, do you want a fast paced sword wielder, or a mace stun machine.

I went for shield and a weapon with at least average attack speed. I started with Warfare first, unlocked Onslaught, maxed it out, then moved to Defense and rushed Shield charge(I absolutely adore this skill, and even though some people say it isn't a good end-game skill, I'm still using it and will continue to do so). After that, similar to Medea, I just went for passive skills that compliment my play style(Weapon training and Armor handling are must-haves), but, because I'm a "face-tank" type of player, I maxed out Battle rage with it's tree, and added Battle standard at the end of Epic difficulty for good measure. As far as how to distribute your points, assess your situation. If for the past couple of levels you found yourself not dying much and killing everything with relative ease, up that mastery bar. If you feel you need a bit more attack power or defense to stay alive, pick a skill, and distribute points between that skill and the mastery bar. The only "rule" I would say you should follow is one skill at a time, if you try to develop several skills at the same time, you'll just get poor results. And don't be afraid to experiment, you can always respec points later if you don't like what you get.

Good luck and don't hesitate to ask about anything you need :)

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Offline DwayneA

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Re: Tips On Character Building
« Reply #5 on: 14 March 2020, 22:07:11 »
Other than the Conqueror, what are some other good classes to use for beginners?

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Offline Tasim

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Re: Tips On Character Building
« Reply #6 on: 15 March 2020, 01:20:33 »
Well, it comes down to personal preference, but from my experience, Dream is really good either combined with Warfare for a Templar, or with Hunting for a Haruspex(bow or spear). I haven't played any pet builds or casters so I can't speak for them, I mostly stick with melee builds in RPG's.

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Offline DwayneA

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Re: Tips On Character Building
« Reply #7 on: 15 March 2020, 01:37:09 »
Templar is Dream and Defense. Dream and Warfare is the Harbinger.

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Offline Tasim

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Re: Tips On Character Building
« Reply #8 on: 15 March 2020, 09:54:21 »
Templar is Dream and Defense. Dream and Warfare is the Harbinger.

You're right, sorry, it was a long day, my brain was already asleep :D

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Offline DwayneA

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Re: Tips On Character Building
« Reply #9 on: 15 March 2020, 15:09:32 »
Wouldn't the end base stats after maxing both masteries determine how you should build your character? For example, if you have low health you should make a caster or a long-range fighter. With high health, you should go melee. With high intelligence, make a caster. With high strength, go melee. With high dexterity, focus on pierce, bleeding, or poison damage.

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Offline Tasim

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Re: Tips On Character Building
« Reply #10 on: 16 March 2020, 06:29:16 »
Well, yeah, it kinda does, but you still have to choose which mastery you're going to be prioritizing and how you distribute your skill/stat points. On top of that, end game gear is a big part of character building, you have to know what you're aiming for. That's where guides come quite handy - you don't have to follow them by heart, but they give you a good idea of end game possibilities and options.

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Offline MedeaFleecestealer

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Re: Tips On Character Building
« Reply #11 on: 16 March 2020, 06:59:00 »
Wouldn't the end base stats after maxing both masteries determine how you should build your character? For example, if you have low health you should make a caster or a long-range fighter. With high health, you should go melee. With high intelligence, make a caster. With high strength, go melee. With high dexterity, focus on pierce, bleeding, or poison damage.

Well, yes and no.  Most classes in the game are hybrids, i.e. a mix of melee/caster.  As you can see from this list done by Irma2 many years ago

https://titanquestfans.net/index.php?topic=679.0

many can concentrate on either the melee or caster side of things more. 

Low health can be easily dealt with by a tip from Poinas many years ago as well. There are 3 quests per difficulty which give you bonus attribute points - Chiron's bow side quest, Imhotep as part of the main quest when you hand over the Hand of Balance and Eye of Chaos and the Terracota Soldiers side quest.  That's 6 points per difficulty - 18 in total.  Use these bonus points to boost health; in the original game that boosted it by 720 iirc, but I think with the AE version it's even more.  Obviously depending on your build and skill useage you could put them into energy instead or split them between the two which is what I often do.

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Offline DwayneA

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Re: Tips On Character Building
« Reply #12 on: 16 March 2020, 22:12:28 »
Some classes were meant to be made only for fighting and others as only caster.

Fighting

Assassin
Berserker
Brigand
Champion
Conqueror
Corsair
Guardian
Runesmith
Slayer
Templar
Warden

Caster

Conjurer
Druid
Elementalist
Oracle
Soothsayer
Summoner
« Last Edit: 16 March 2020, 22:30:59 by DwayneA »

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Offline MedeaFleecestealer

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Re: Tips On Character Building
« Reply #13 on: 16 March 2020, 22:40:30 »
From the game manual with the disc version of the game.

Full Melee: Warrior (Warfare), Defender (Defense), Conqueror, Slayer, Warden
Melee: Hunter (Hunting), Rogue (Rogue), Corsair, Brigand, Assassin
Caster: Theurgist (Spirit), Wanderer (Nature), Soothsayer, Summoner, Druid
Full Caster: Stormcaller (Storm), Pyromancer (Earth), Conjurer, Oracle, Elementalist
Hybrid: Spellbreaker, Spellbinder, Bone Charmer, Warlock, Champion, Guardian, Ranger, Illusionist, Magician, Sorcerer, Avenger, Sage, Thane, Paladin, Battlemage, Juggernaut

They didn't do a similar list for the IT expansion, but this is what I consider them to be:

Melee: Harbinger, Templar
Caster: Evoker, Prophet, Ritualist, Diviner
Hybrid: Haruspex, Dreamkiller

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Offline DwayneA

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Re: Tips On Character Building
« Reply #14 on: 16 March 2020, 23:22:52 »
what do they mean by full melee/caster? What's the difference between a full and a normal?

Also, is there a similar list for Ragnarok?

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