Author Topic: Dragon Hunter is the best Rune class?  (Read 49165 times)

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Offline AnnaLusia

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Re: Dragon Hunter is the best Rune class?
« Reply #15 on: 15 October 2018, 19:55:40 »
A bit out of the topic, but why are you considering Cerberus one of the toughest challenges? A decent health pool + fire resistance and maxed out Herbal Remedy and you will be good, right?

For 2 reasons...
1. When im still a newb and havent found out about this forum, after and before normal Typhon i dont found any hard to kill bosses, maybe the centaur Nessus since you will be only like lvl 6 and you need to chug potions and need sometime to kill him. Until i got trapped in that small room with that nasty dog, never pay attention to the resistance and stuff and those green light from the floor just kill me almost instantly
2. Compared to Typhon battlefield which is quite large, Cerberus stage is quite small and hard to hit and run (my favourite stye obviously). So i think Cerberus and Charon is quite a challenge for this same reason.

Study Prey gives even more -resistance to piercing that Flush out does to Elemental Resist.

RW gives elemental damage, so you are going to be doing 1/3 fire, 1/3 cold and 1/3rd lightning and only that.  So, clearly focusing on +elemental damage works best.  For Marksmanship, you are in a similar boat in terms of damage.  You have physical from the weapon and piercing from the ratio and bonuses.  You can also factor in bleeding. 

Bow doesn't give you the Reckless Offence Proc, which is significant in terms of damage.  Also, it is one item instead of two, with additional bonuses.  I'm assuming Thunderstrike only send out 5 daggers instead of 10. 

RW is definitely a stronger single target damage dealer (though, a lot of that also depends on itemization).  A Marksman can go DEX/STR or SEX/INT for armor where a RW is stuck with INT/DEX (for Stonebinders). 
Err when i got maxed WBDbE, did i lose the pierce damage from the Weapon? Even if it lose the pierce damage, i think the RW damage output will be bigger than pierce dmg with Mark. The 140%int with 35%ele dmg and total damage on maxed+4 is quite a number, how can i calculate its damage? Can you probably test it out when it reach lvl 14 charge and you open the character window and see the dps output at that time and compare it to the dps output when it has no charge at all?

Oh and the Nyx got this supeeer good frostburn effect which will slow enemies.

I think pierce damage is always godly in TQ and the Mark with bow is probably one of the best skill in the game, like i said earlier, if i have to bet, then i would put my bet on hunting if theres any solo class legendary finish challenge. Again thats probably bcoz i prefer to hit and run instead of going wham with melee. I think i should use Aphro Favor instead of Brisingamen. And Marduk artifact for an extra 20%int and a lifesaver skill if somehow enemies got past my Sacred Rage.

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Offline botebote77

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Re: Dragon Hunter is the best Rune class?
« Reply #16 on: 15 October 2018, 21:20:57 »
in xmax, cerberus is very very hard even with 80% poison res.. because DoT stacks from different enemies
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Offline WNG

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Re: Dragon Hunter is the best Rune class?
« Reply #17 on: 15 October 2018, 23:30:00 »
A bit out of the topic, but why are you considering Cerberus one of the toughest challenges? A decent health pool + fire resistance and maxed out Herbal Remedy and you will be good, right?

For 2 reasons...
1. When im still a newb and havent found out about this forum, after and before normal Typhon i dont found any hard to kill bosses, maybe the centaur Nessus since you will be only like lvl 6 and you need to chug potions and need sometime to kill him. Until i got trapped in that small room with that nasty dog, never pay attention to the resistance and stuff and those green light from the floor just kill me almost instantly
2. Compared to Typhon battlefield which is quite large, Cerberus stage is quite small and hard to hit and run (my favourite stye obviously). So i think Cerberus and Charon is quite a challenge for this same reason.

Study Prey gives even more -resistance to piercing that Flush out does to Elemental Resist.

RW gives elemental damage, so you are going to be doing 1/3 fire, 1/3 cold and 1/3rd lightning and only that.  So, clearly focusing on +elemental damage works best.  For Marksmanship, you are in a similar boat in terms of damage.  You have physical from the weapon and piercing from the ratio and bonuses.  You can also factor in bleeding. 

Bow doesn't give you the Reckless Offence Proc, which is significant in terms of damage.  Also, it is one item instead of two, with additional bonuses.  I'm assuming Thunderstrike only send out 5 daggers instead of 10. 

RW is definitely a stronger single target damage dealer (though, a lot of that also depends on itemization).  A Marksman can go DEX/STR or SEX/INT for armor where a RW is stuck with INT/DEX (for Stonebinders). 
Err when i got maxed WBDbE, did i lose the pierce damage from the Weapon? Even if it lose the pierce damage, i think the RW damage output will be bigger than pierce dmg with Mark. The 140%int with 35%ele dmg and total damage on maxed+4 is quite a number, how can i calculate its damage? Can you probably test it out when it reach lvl 14 charge and you open the character window and see the dps output at that time and compare it to the dps output when it has no charge at all?

Oh and the Nyx got this supeeer good frostburn effect which will slow enemies.

I think pierce damage is always godly in TQ and the Mark with bow is probably one of the best skill in the game, like i said earlier, if i have to bet, then i would put my bet on hunting if theres any solo class legendary finish challenge. Again thats probably bcoz i prefer to hit and run instead of going wham with melee. I think i should use Aphro Favor instead of Brisingamen. And Marduk artifact for an extra 20%int and a lifesaver skill if somehow enemies got past my Sacred Rage.

You certainly should try and experiment different gear loadouts and play what you feel best with. There are some more popular choices for some classes, but always use what suits you best. For the artifact I'd probably go for Elemental Rage here (might be overpowered) but maybe could Marduk's Tablet of Destiny work here. You tell us.

Also, don't give too much attention to the DPS displayed in the character window. It's cool to see the little number rise, but it is very inaccurate (for the best or for the worst) since it doesn't take  a lot of things into account (such as your LMB, for example.)

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Offline mammoth_hunter

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Re: Dragon Hunter is the best Rune class?
« Reply #18 on: 16 October 2018, 00:26:41 »
Also, don't give too much attention to the DPS displayed in the character window. It's cool to see the little number rise, but it is very inaccurate (for the best or for the worst) since it doesn't take  a lot of things into account (such as your LMB, for example.)
As a general advice this is sound, but not for rune weapon - for that skill tooltip DPS number is accurate. Everything it has - it places on your weapon in the form of charges. Converted weapon damage, flat damage, %int affecting all. Using this one for comparisons is fine.

Marduk's tablet of destiny is vitality and spirit mastery related.

I think when physical weapon has %piercing and is converted to elemental, elemental conversion happens first, and conversion to piercing does not happen at all.

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Offline AnnaLusia

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Re: Dragon Hunter is the best Rune class?
« Reply #19 on: 16 October 2018, 01:12:40 »

A bit out of the topic, but why are you considering Cerberus one of the toughest challenges? A decent health pool + fire resistance and maxed out Herbal Remedy and you will be good, right?

For 2 reasons...
1. When im still a newb and havent found out about this forum, after and before normal Typhon i dont found any hard to kill bosses, maybe the centaur Nessus since you will be only like lvl 6 and you need to chug potions and need sometime to kill him. Until i got trapped in that small room with that nasty dog, never pay attention to the resistance and stuff and those green light from the floor just kill me almost instantly
2. Compared to Typhon battlefield which is quite large, Cerberus stage is quite small and hard to hit and run (my favourite stye obviously). So i think Cerberus and Charon is quite a challenge for this same reason.

Study Prey gives even more -resistance to piercing that Flush out does to Elemental Resist.

RW gives elemental damage, so you are going to be doing 1/3 fire, 1/3 cold and 1/3rd lightning and only that.  So, clearly focusing on +elemental damage works best.  For Marksmanship, you are in a similar boat in terms of damage.  You have physical from the weapon and piercing from the ratio and bonuses.  You can also factor in bleeding. 

Bow doesn't give you the Reckless Offence Proc, which is significant in terms of damage.  Also, it is one item instead of two, with additional bonuses.  I'm assuming Thunderstrike only send out 5 daggers instead of 10. 

RW is definitely a stronger single target damage dealer (though, a lot of that also depends on itemization).  A Marksman can go DEX/STR or SEX/INT for armor where a RW is stuck with INT/DEX (for Stonebinders). 
Err when i got maxed WBDbE, did i lose the pierce damage from the Weapon? Even if it lose the pierce damage, i think the RW damage output will be bigger than pierce dmg with Mark. The 140%int with 35%ele dmg and total damage on maxed+4 is quite a number, how can i calculate its damage? Can you probably test it out when it reach lvl 14 charge and you open the character window and see the dps output at that time and compare it to the dps output when it has no charge at all?

Oh and the Nyx got this supeeer good frostburn effect which will slow enemies.

I think pierce damage is always godly in TQ and the Mark with bow is probably one of the best skill in the game, like i said earlier, if i have to bet, then i would put my bet on hunting if theres any solo class legendary finish challenge. Again thats probably bcoz i prefer to hit and run instead of going wham with melee. I think i should use Aphro Favor instead of Brisingamen. And Marduk artifact for an extra 20%int and a lifesaver skill if somehow enemies got past my Sacred Rage.

You certainly should try and experiment different gear loadouts and play what you feel best with. There are some more popular choices for some classes, but always use what suits you best. For the artifact I'd probably go for Elemental Rage here (might be overpowered) but maybe could Marduk's Tablet of Destiny work here. You tell us.

Also, don't give too much attention to the DPS displayed in the character window. It's cool to see the little number rise, but it is very inaccurate (for the best or for the worst) since it doesn't take  a lot of things into account (such as your LMB, for example.)

Oh thanks for pointing elemental rage out, i only focus on divine artifact when im thinking on the artifact, but i will still try the marduk for its 20% bonus int. I want to know how much %int bonus effecting my DPS with this build.

Also, don't give too much attention to the DPS displayed in the character window. It's cool to see the little number rise, but it is very inaccurate (for the best or for the worst) since it doesn't take  a lot of things into account (such as your LMB, for example.)
As a general advice this is sound, but not for rune weapon - for that skill tooltip DPS number is accurate. Everything it has - it places on your weapon in the form of charges. Converted weapon damage, flat damage, %int affecting all. Using this one for comparisons is fine.

Marduk's tablet of destiny is vitality and spirit mastery related.

I think when physical weapon has %piercing and is converted to elemental, elemental conversion happens first, and conversion to piercing does not happen at all.

The Marduk other point beside the %int is it safety device skill when im low on health..sacred rage activated after im below 40% and another skill activated when i got even lower haha but i wonder will it be effective..i have to give it a try. Or maybe the energy absorb from elemental rage will be enough for my survivalbility

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Offline botebote77

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Re: Dragon Hunter is the best Rune class?
« Reply #20 on: 16 October 2018, 01:43:03 »
about rune weapon DPS stat sheet, it is mostly accurate because it shows the damage increase when charging.. BUT.. most monsters in legendary have elemental resists and that is something the stat sheet cannot show.. these are just persnal observances and no concrete proof:

beasts/beastmen have some elemental resists but maybe weak against fire.. plants have some resists against lightning but also weak against fire.. frost and fire sprites yep.. and the jotuns

as for marduk's.. well, I'm familiar with squishy characters :))
most of the time in legendary you won't even hear that "DUDUN" sound when you die.. so that absorption proc will not even trigger
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Offline AnnaLusia

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Re: Dragon Hunter is the best Rune class?
« Reply #21 on: 16 October 2018, 01:57:32 »
about rune weapon DPS stat sheet, it is mostly accurate because it shows the damage increase when charging.. BUT.. most monsters in legendary have elemental resists and that is something the stat sheet cannot show.. these are just persnal observances and no concrete proof:

beasts/beastmen have some elemental resists but maybe weak against fire.. plants have some resists against lightning but also weak against fire.. frost and fire sprites yep.. and the jotuns

as for marduk's.. well, I'm familiar with squishy characters :))
most of the time in legendary you won't even hear that "DUDUN" sound when you die.. so that absorption proc will not even trigger

So basically how is this elemental stuff works?

But no matter what, i think to increase your int and getting +%eledmg is a must for this build. And i think Flush Out kinda answers how to deal with high resistance enemies.

Have you try the Marduk with Sacred Rage stacked? If it still doesnt work then i will go with ElemRage.

Oh and i wonder, lets say i could get 100% WBDbE from gears..like lets say 2x Moirae and Golden Agris Helm...basically i dont have to spend any points in transmute right?

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Offline botebote77

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Re: Dragon Hunter is the best Rune class?
« Reply #22 on: 16 October 2018, 05:09:47 »
So basically how is this elemental stuff works?
i also don't know :(
i guess just playing the game over and over again with different characters and see what works.. but i can say lighting works against everything.. plants still take damage from lightning.. it just seems like they are more susceptible to fire than lightning

edit: but mages that have storm nimbus aura.. it seems they have resistance against lightning no matter what their race is.. but it's weird because ice shards work well against them

Have you try the Marduk with Sacred Rage stacked? If it still doesnt work then i will go with ElemRage.
nope.. and it's not that it doesn't work.. i just mean for a squishy toon with low health, you might not even get to that 10% or 15% HP before you die.. and dual thrown dragon hunter looks like a squishy toon with low HP

Oh and i wonder, lets say i could get 100% WBDbE from gears..like lets say 2x Moirae and Golden Agris Helm...basically i dont have to spend any points in transmute right?
somewhere in the later changelogs, it was mentioned that transmutation is now permanently active as long as you have points on it.. and i think it's easier to spend points on transmutation and be free of those items.. but the answer is yes you'll have 100% conversion with those items even without transmutation

edit:
blessing of the moirae  -  33% conversion ( thrown)
eitr  -  20%   (charm)
gambanteinn  -  50%   (artifact)
golden agris  -  50%   (helm)
falcon cape  -  50%   (torso)
hofud  -  50%    (sword)
« Last Edit: 16 October 2018, 05:22:34 by botebote77 »
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Offline tholuneve

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Re: Dragon Hunter is the best Rune class?
« Reply #23 on: 16 October 2018, 05:59:41 »
It's true that you can get 100% conversion from gears only. However, in currect game version, skill points aren't worth a thing and every gear slot is precious. If something can be solved either with skill points or gears, it is a better choice to solve it with skill points in most cases.

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